Modern Drummer=No knowledge

[PortmanGroove]

Pocket player. I used to think that man.....
I had a question for Larry Aberman through ask a pro, that never got answered. That was 2 years ago. I emailed Larry, and he said he knew nothing about it.Steve Hass came through town with Scofield. That's how I found this board actually. Anyways I emailed modern drummer about the ask a pro column again. I had some questions for Steve, and figured his response would be more detailed through modern drummer. I got an email back saying, thanks and we'll forward this to Steve. Two months later, I emailed Steve. He knew nothing about it.How do you explain that? Is that column even real? I wish I could have that care free attitude like CL does. I'm on Groove's page. Shouldn't modern drummer represent? What's up with that?

<font color="#a62a2a" size="1">[ November 20, 2005 12:31 PM: Message edited by: PortJazz ]</font>

[dr-funkenstein]

dont let semantics eat you up. KC is a young drummer (early 30s i beleive) and his young career has been quite succesfull. louie is old, buddy is so old hes dead, dejohnette is old, keith is young. in the context of the whole art that is drumming, KC is new.

Rodney Holmes is a MASTER of latin rythms by all standards except the most stringent of stadards that would require someone to be born from a particular region and to have grown up in completely immersed in that scene/style. ie horacio. buy these standards the only thing i am a master of is playing metal with white people.

[Groovesmitty]

Age has nothing to do with it my friend. When Gadd was 30, he was not an up and comer. Niether is Keith.

Drummers who were not raised on Latin music that play it authentically with the authentic latin musicians in the scene today:

Antonio Sanchez
Matt Walker
Phil Maturano
Jeff "Tain" Watts
Cliff Almond
Steve Hass
Steve Berrios
and many many more.

[CLWarunki]

You guys are right about the readers poll not being MD's fault and that brings me to the point that MD in the last couple years has really been trying to tap into a younger demographic for it's readers... I bet the issue with Travis Barker on the cover outsold the issue featuring Roy Hanes by quite a few copies!

Calling Keith Carlock up-and-coming makes sense to the younger cats that don't listen to much Steely Dan or Sting and to me too becuase until he was on that SD album in 2003, nobody knew his name! Well, the majority of MD readers, I'm sure did not. Now they do. He is in the public eye now, and might be approaching the pinnacle of his career. He's a very "NOW" drummer. A very "Modern Drummer". So up-and-coming is not too far off.

Calling someone a "Latin Drummer" really is narrowing things down. I'm sure Horacio could play rock, funk, blues, jazz and many other styles. Infact I know he can. I've seen him perform and met him too. Same with Rodney and anyone else mentioned above... why worry about labeling them to ONE genre?

Labels are for jars.

[Groovesmitty]

Sorry CL, I disagree on most counts here.

Keith was playing with Grover Washington Jr, and The Blues Brothers long before Steely Dan. The previous drummers on those gigs were, Steve Gadd, and with BBros, Steve Gadd and Danny Gottlieb. Those drum chairs are huge. Whether or not you knew about him, he was still a heavyhitter. The fact that you didn't know about him can also be attributed to MD's " being out of the loop" as Flarob called it a while back. He was on the Steely Dan tour in later half of 2001. Later he recorded with them. My friend, thats about 6 years ago. Long time.

Horacio's only pro rock experience was with Santana. He was fired after the first portion of the tour, because of his inconsistant rock time. I remember this because the word on the street was that he was fired for showing off too much, I later found out from a member of Angelique Kidjo's band, that his rock playing was not cutting the gig. So maybe you don't know as much about his playing as you think. He's a latin jazz drummer. If he were an amazing rock drummer as well, do you honestly think he would be doing latin jazz tours with Eddie Palmieri? That is some of the lowest paying music one can chose to play.
And if he was this great rocking drummer wouldn't Nini Camps have Horacio playing drumset, instead of playing percussion along side Steve Hass on her album called So Long?
http://www.ninicamps.com/store.html

Correct lables or categories are important. Some can do many others play on or two.

<font color="#a62a2a" size="1">[ November 21, 2005 08:41 AM: Message edited by: Groovesmitty ]</font>

[Henry II]

I like MD and Drum, though I prefer MD as it has more focus on jazz than drum. Mislabeling aside, I owe a lot to MD for what I've learned over the years.

[JohnDrum]

Labels are for jars

right on Chris!!!!! [img]cool.gif[/img]

[CLWarunki]

Groove... Horacio is a diverse drummer, just like any true professional drummer... he can play many styles, but he is strongest as a "Latin Drummer" - I agree. Obviously because this is his background and in his upbringing. Maybe I would feel agitated if someone called him a "Funk Drummer" or "Heavy Metal Drummer" but I guess that would just be another persons POV or maybe misconception. I see your point.

About Carlock, he is an amazing drummer who's played in some major acts RECENTLY, within the last 5-6 years. If he's been doing that for 10-20 years then he wouldn't be "up and coming".

I passed up a MAJOR gig that came knocking on my door when I was 19 because I didn't want to gain a reputation and be labeled as a drummer of that particular genre... but in hindsight I really should not have been so conscious of labels. I just knew that I would not be happy if I was written-off simply as a "(insert genre here)Drummer".

[Willy Brown]

It's a matter of perspective. Keith Carlock plays at the same festival as Roy Haynes and Roy Haynes headlines: Who is the relative "up and comer"?

You want to trade Modern Drummer for Drum! You want to trade sincere, in-depth coverage for cursory, casual treatment? That's your prerogative. When all is said and done, MD is a hundred times the publication.

With respect to Rodney Holmes being "a jazz drummer", he once told me that he learned every single Tony Williams lick he could extract from all those Miles albums, such as the Plugged Nickel. He was a Tony fanatic. Meanwhile, man's got to work and he works outside what you (and I) term "jazz". No sin there.

Beware, there are a lot of so-called jazz drummers much less capable than Rodney Holmes just as there are a lot of so-called Latin drummers masquerading as such, simply because they can execute the circus trick of playing a two/three clave with a pedal/Garcia Bracket/bell. Half of them wouldn't know a two-three clave from a ballroom Beguine; it's all mechanics.

It's all the way you see and hear and perceive. Lot of wasted energy going on above.....
WB

[Groovesmitty]

Ok you all have my apologies here for this statement. Willie has extracted it with his post.
I live close to NYC and have had the chance to hear Rodney play jazz. His jazz time is NOT happening. Does not swing. Could not compare with a labled jazz drummer such as Lewis Nash.

Willie is also contradicting himself by saying Rodney learned the mechanics of Tony therefor he can play jazz, but most "latin" drummers are mascarading because they learned left foot clave.
Well both are mechanics. Learning licks off of Live At The Plugged Nickel or left foot clave.

Some of it is perception, but not all.

<font color="#a62a2a" size="1">[ November 23, 2005 04:09 PM: Message edited by: Groovesmitty ]</font>